From Burnout to Buyouts: Escaping the 9 to 5 and Building Your Own Financial Empire with Gus Ofili
Key Takeaways
- Betting on yourself can lead to explosive growth if you're willing to work harder than everyone else.
- Real estate sales are just the starting line—long-term wealth is built through strategic investing.
- A “burn the fleet” mindset can turn fear into focus and setbacks into opportunity.
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The REI Agent with Gus Ofili
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The Catalyst: A Graduation, A Conference, and a Bigger Vision
This episode of The REI Agent Podcast kicks off with co-host Mattias reflecting on a personal milestone, his daughter’s graduation from daycare, and how family moments like these intertwine with bigger dreams.
Having just returned from the REI Summit in Austin, Mattias and Erica found themselves reignited with purpose.
They weren’t just building wealth; they were building a family legacy.
They even turned to AI to help translate their family’s core values into kid-friendly wisdom.
“I hadn’t thought of that use of ChatGPT yet—how I can translate these big concepts to kids,” Mattias shared, inspired to shape his children’s character with intention and clarity.
Burn the Fleet: Gus Ofili’s Leap from Stability to Savage Hustle
Enter Gus Ofili, a man who didn’t just dip his toe into real estate. He dove in, scorched the shore, and never looked back.
After years at Bank of America, constantly overlooked for promotions and crushed by corporate red tape, Gus had a decision to make.
“I talked to my wife, my brothers, my parents... I cleared out my 401k and bet on myself.”
That one decision launched a domino effect. Gus was done waiting for permission.
He met with brokers, grilled seasoned agents, and told himself, “If they can do it, I can do it better.”
He didn’t just get into real estate. He bulldozed his way through it. Within his rookie year, Gus closed 50 transactions.
Not 5.
Not 15.
Fifty.
And he did it by becoming the “yes man” that everyone needed, answering phones, doing open houses, posting creative skits on Facebook, and even accepting nightmare listings others refused to touch.
“I needed people to believe in me. So I showed up, took action, and built my name from nothing.”
From Commission Checks to Cash Flow: The Pivot into Investing
While Gus was crushing sales, he was watching his investor clients rake in far more with far less effort.
He recalls seeing a client earn $175,000 on a flip while Gus walked away with a $5,000 commission.
“I’m doing the math. I’m like, this doesn’t add up.”
That’s when the switch flipped. Instead of selling properties, Gus started buying them.
His first deal?
A five-unit building he originally planned to list for someone else. But when a buyer’s financing fell through, Gus took the leap. That one purchase became the spark that ignited an empire.
He quickly transitioned to the BRRRR strategy, buy, rehab, rent, refinance, repeat, allowing him to recycle his money and scale fast. His weapon of choice? Business lines of credit.
“Now I’m not even using my own money. I’m using bank money to build my future.”
The Growth Mindset: Why Gus Isn't Slowing Down
Despite selling over 100 homes in back-to-back years, Gus knew burnout was creeping in.
So he made another bold move, he stepped back from being a full-time agent to become a full-time investor. Some questioned the decision.
But Gus? He was laser-focused.
“I watched guys get rich just by holding properties when the pandemic hit. Now it’s my turn.”
Today, Gus operates with a mindset of abundance and long-term vision.
He's not chasing flashy cars or surface-level success. He's building generational wealth, one property at a time.
“I don’t wanna look rich. I wanna be wealthy.”
Final Thoughts: Build Your Freedom Brick by Brick
This episode is a masterclass in guts, grit, and growth.
Gus Ofili didn’t wait for ideal conditions.
He created them.
He didn’t start with connections or capital.
He started with courage and conviction.
“Being an agent is your entry into real estate. Once you’re in the room, pay attention. That’s where everything changes.”
Mattias closed out the episode with a reminder that wealth isn’t just financial, it’s holistic.
It’s about freedom, family, and fulfillment. And if you stay focused and intentional, like Gus, your breakthrough is coming too.
Are you ready to burn the fleet and bet on yourself?
Stay tuned for more inspiring stories on The REI Agent podcast, your go-to source for insights, inspiration, and strategies from top agents and investors who are living their best lives through real estate.
For more content and episodes, visit reiagent.com.
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- Achieving Holistic Wealth and Success Through Real Estate (Insights from The REI Agent)
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Transcript
Welcome to the REI Agent, a holistic approach to life through real estate. I'm Mattias, an agent and investor.
And I'm Erica, a licensed therapist.
Join us as we interview guests that also strive to live bold and fulfilled lives through business and real estate investing.
Tune in every week for interviews with real estate agents and investors.
Ready to level up?
Let's do it.
Welcome back to the REI Agent. It's just Mattias.
Today, we had a little graduation celebration. So my middle child is getting out of the daycare that we're at. We are at a local university, has a young child program.
Shout out to JMU YCP. And they do a phenomenal job in general. Our daughter has been there for, this is second year now.
She graduated from the program. She's still gonna be there in summer school. So it wasn't like crying and hugging teachers that they'll never see them again.
But she'll be there through the summer, but then she gets to go to her elementary school, which is just kind of crazy to think about. We're about to go out and grab ice cream. And then my littlest, he also got to perform.
He didn't have a graduation ceremony, but he got to perform a couple songs. He was just standing there like a deer in the headlights, just like, what is happening? Sucking his thumb.
And then I went to get him afterwards and it just took him like 20 minutes of just like, what was going on? What is that feeling? I don't know what stage fright is.
I've never had that before. But I think at the end of the day, he was back to himself in a couple minutes and enjoyed the thrill of it maybe. But yeah, we also, Eric and I just got back from Austin.
We were at a conference, REI Summit Conference, learning about investing more. And it was a really fun time. We got to go a couple days early to explore the city a little bit.
And then we had the conference itself and really enjoyed it. One of the things that we came back with was we've been kind of intentional about, or I've been intentional about my life in kind of general, being focused on various things in the business, but trying to be intentional with our life as well. But we came back kind of motivated to actually kind of apply some of the things you do in business to our family, trying to have like a vision, values, mission statement, that kind of stuff.
And we're really eager to see how that implements into our lives. So we spent a good amount of time crafting as much as we could before we got really burned out. We spent a good three, four hours on the way home working on that.
That was Wednesday. This is a Friday. Working on those values and missions and all that kind of stuff.
And the next challenge is trying to see how that all comes up with our kids. I think we're gonna try to get them involved in a conversation a little bit in general. The youngest one probably will just be throwing rocks or eating dirt or something while we have this conversation.
But maybe at least the oldest one will have some things to contribute. And we'll do our best to try to make these big ideas bite-sized for the kids. And actually we use ChatGPT, haven't finished the process, but we use ChatGPT to kind of like create two different.
So if we have like a category, like let's say total ownership is one of the categories of our values we wanna give to our kids. Being standing, following through with what you say you will being honest, that kind of stuff. Owning your life so that you're not playing a victim, you're not blaming others.
We asked, we kind of made the big flowery word version and then we asked ChatGPT to actually translate that into something that a younger kid could understand into easier concepts. And it did pretty well. So I think there's definitely room there when you're thinking of those big concepts.
And I like to, man, I wanna give our kids speeches. And they are not old enough for these speeches yet, but I wanna give them. And anyway, so I hadn't thought of that use of ChatGPT yet, how I can translate these big concepts to kids.
And so I'm excited about what that looks like. I think we're gonna have vacations coming up or we're gonna have like some dedicated time. And to really going through these, getting their input as well, explaining these different visions or values in the mission statement and vision.
And just, I'm encouraged to see how that really impacts their life going forward and how that imprints them. Because I think when you have some clear guidelines, some clear boundaries and some clear reasons why, that can really inform the relationships you have going forward as they're older, the way you treat others, the way your character develops. And a lot of the times I've been concerned, I've been worried about how, what I do with building wealth or having assets, all that kind of stuff.
Will that hurt my kids long-term? Will that be something that they actually have, will be worse off from having that? Will they not be motivated?
Will they, what will that do to them? And so I think this really spoke to me as a way to try to instill some of those core values. I think another one that I really appreciated was having this like kind of growth mindset, but also just being passionate, like pursuing stuff that you're passionate about.
I think that's, it's such an unfulfilled life if you are never pursuing what you're passionate about. If you are the proverbial, just drinking cocktails on the beach, if that's all you do, that's just depressing. And I think, yes, vacations are nice, there's a place for that kind of stuff.
But at the end of the day, the real fulfillment, the real enjoyment comes from flow, from relationships, deep relationships, and from, yeah, just being passionate about stuff. So anyway, we're excited about that. We'll probably talk about that more in the future.
But anyway, we have Gus Ofili today. Gus is a tunnel vision person, he said that himself. And very impressive, very impressive.
He took the burn the fleet approach in getting into real estate. There's something that I discuss with people often and contemplate as to what to recommend. And I don't think there's a one size fits all approach, but Gus went out and said, I'm gonna be a real estate agent, put in his two weeks notice and got after it.
And is a success story for that. And I think a lot of that fire was needed, or just fueled how hard he was gonna work. And we talk about how my approach was different, it was a different time, market was different, there's different factors there.
So there's not a one size fits all. But I think when you kind of contemplate making a move like that, it's helpful to hear other people's experiences and why, and how they did what they did, so that you can make a decision what scenario fits right for you in your situation. So part of that can be, if you wanna buy a house, having two years of experience in a real estate, the income from real estate is required before you can count it for a mortgage.
So there's a few different factors there, but obviously, he is killing it in sales. He was killing it in sales. He talks about how he is more focused on investing now, but he's a perfect guest for the show, because he marries the two, and kind of explains, yeah, how to be successful in both.
So without further ado, let's get Gus on the show. Welcome back to the REI Agent. I'm here with Gus Ofili.
Gus, thanks so much for joining us.
I appreciate it, thanks for having me.
Now, Gus, tell me a little bit about your backstory.
You're pretty perfect for this show. You're both an agent and an investor, is that correct?
Yes, that's correct.
Yeah, tell me how you got into real estate.
So yeah, I'm gonna start from the beginning, and this is kind of like everyone's story at the beginning, is I'm working my regular nine to five. Out of college, I jump right into Bank of America. It was a call center at Bank of America.
We deal with the credit cards. I got there. I wasn't able to really find jobs right out of college, so this is my entry level into a Fortune 500 company.
Once I got there, I kind of took off within the company as an employee, not on the management level. So I started selling a lot. The whole object of the job was to go ahead and do balance transfers and open new credit cards to people.
So I was with the company. Within three years, I become in a lead role, and what I started to notice in that lead role is I'm ready to become a manager now. I'm ready to run the whole shop, and anytime there was opportunities for me to go ahead and have that position, I would go ahead and interview, and I was told, oh, this is why you didn't get in.
This is why you didn't get it. So after three, four times, I'm like, you know, is this ever gonna happen? And I think one of the biggest things for me that a light switched in my head was when I would see the managers, they would try to keep me at bay.
And what I mean, keep me at bay, is this guy doesn't do it like how everyone else does it. He likes to kind of do his own thing, and it's not the normal way we do it. So when I would think of creative ideas to keep a team that I'm looking over, focus on the job, it would be something that no one does.
They would tell the unit manager what I'm doing, and he would bring me in my office. He says, Gus, that's a great idea, but this is not how it's supposed to be. You're supposed to be like this.
And also, Gus, you gotta start creating relationships with the managers. How can I put you there? And I'm thinking, I'm like, isn't it about production?
Isn't it about what my team is doing to make me get in these positions? Why do I have to be best friends with everyone? Not that there's anything wrong with it, but I'm an introvert, and I'm kind of a loner.
I've been like that for as far as I can remember, and I only let a certain amount of people in my circle. So as time went on, a second thing happened. I was on a phone call, it was a manager call.
Even though I'm not a manager, I was able to take manager calls. It was an older individual who was in a tight situation as far as money. And then when I was looking, we were able to look at their accounts and things like that.
She was on retirement. And I'm like, dang, that's all they get for retirement? And then, so this is a person who worked all their life, and now they're at the point where, in my opinion, they should be enjoying it.
That's what people have to think. A lot of them were close to retirement, and they would talk about it. I'm like, that doesn't sound like something I wanna be in.
So for the strength of that, my wife now, but my girlfriend at the time, her brother-in-law owned a title company. And she was like, hey, have you ever thought about being a real estate agent? Maybe you could do that on the side.
I was like, nah, I never thought about it. She's like, you could talk to my brother-in-law about it. So I had lunch with him.
We started talking about it. I was like, all right, this sounds like something interesting. This sounds like something I could do on the side.
So I took the class, and the class is what got me. Had a great professor who taught us the class. And he didn't teach us the textbook way.
Of course, you have to teach that stuff for us to pass. He would bring up his experiences, and we would ask questions about it. And I was like, oh, wow, this sounds like something I wanna do.
And then he said a key thing. If you wanna be successful, and you wanna make money as a real estate agent, you're gonna have to do this 100%. He said, the people that do this part-time, they miss a phone call, and that call goes on to someone else.
Then I'm thinking, I'm working this job, and we can't even bring our phones onto the floor. So if I'm becoming a real estate agent, and people reach out to me, I don't have a way to pick up the phone. And I was talking to my wife now, but I was talking to her, I was like, I think I wanna quit my job.
And then she's like, let's do it, let's do it. And I'm like, okay. The biggest fan that I got, she's down with it.
I got two younger brothers. I talked to them, I talked to my parents, and I thought about it. I'm like, all right, what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna clear out my 401k, and I'm gonna bank on myself.
But before I do that, I reached out to all the local real estate agencies around my area. I met with them all. So I kinda started creating this buzz a little bit about myself.
Because I did well in these one-on-one meetings. And the follow-up I had is, I wanna speak to an agent that's been here for one year. So every person, broker I spoke to, I wanted to speak to an agent that's been here for one year.
I sat back, I listened to the agents, and I was like this, and I'm very competitive. So sometimes that's a big flaw in my character, but if this person can do it, I can definitely do this. That was the thing that reassured me.
So at the bank, I let them know, hey, I'm putting in my two weeks. They were like, Gus, you got a bright future here. I'm like, I appreciate it, but I'm gonna go ahead and try to do this real estate agent thing.
And they were like, well, at least do your two weeks. So if it doesn't work, I'm able to come back. I did it, but I knew I wasn't coming back.
So I cashed out my 401k, and I started my journey as far as being a real estate agent.
That's awesome. You know, man, you brought me right back. I worked in customer service, customer care, in Rosetta Stone for a little bit.
And it was probably the, I mean, in some ways, I enjoyed aspects of it, but I think the job itself was probably one of the worst fits I've ever had. But yeah, you just brought me back to why I love being able to just to do what I want when I want. And maybe that's scary to some people.
Maybe they just don't have that excitement about chasing things down and kind of being self-motivated. But, oh man, I couldn't go back now. Like, it would be so hard to go back to having that bureaucracy, that level, different levels of management, the exact formula of how you're supposed to do things.
And, oh man, that just brings back memories.
One thing I knew, I was a workaholic. So through the year, so you get three weeks vacation, and then you get like, no, it was two weeks vacation, and like, somehow it worked. It was a month with vacation and sick time.
I would never take vacation. I would never be sick. And I worked a crap load of overtime.
So I'm already a workaholic. So come December, I'm taking the whole month off because I have to, or I lose the time for the next year. My brother was like, Gus, you do that.
And how much money are you making the bank? Probably a lot. You know, how much are you getting of that money?
No, my brother's already an entrepreneur, so he already knows this. Imagine taking all that time and effort and you putting it into your own business, how much you get from return.
Yeah.
Amen, bro, it makes sense.
Yeah, no, it's so true. It's so true. That's interesting you talked about the whole, you know, going all in, burn the fleet, sink or swim model.
It's definitely something that I think, A, it really depends on what job you're doing and how compatible it is. It sounds like yours would not have been at all. When I started real estate myself, I was in a high school working as like a behavior specialist and I got off about at three o'clock.
I was able to kind of answer emails and texts kind of throughout the day as I needed. And sometimes if I could, I would go sneak a call out, take a call outside when I needed to. And then I had summers off.
So like it, to me, it felt like it was fairly conducive. And also I just had that like, that like, this is what I'm doing. Like I'm, this is, you know, I'm so focused.
I'm getting up at 5 a.m. every morning and I'm, you know, cranking out as much as I can before work and just completely committed to it. Be pre-kids, you know, when I could have a little bit more time. But I guess all it's to say is you think, would you, if in a different occupation, do you think you would have gone back and done it more gradually or do you think that was the right call or just jumping right in?
You know, as easy as it is because it's already happened for me, it was the right call. 100%, I think it was the right call for me. Now, I think everyone's situation is different.
Once again, when that instructor told me, you'll lose business if you're doing anything else but this. And I was like, all right, I'm all in, I gotta go. And I think, and you know this, taking risk is where you get the biggest reward.
And that was like my first risk because, you know, I'm at a job for seven and a half years. There's no real risk in that, that's automatic money. Now, if I'm gonna do something and I'm gonna change my life and leave a job I've already set the groundwork for, it's gotta be for something way bigger and I had to take that risk.
And it seemed like it may have paid out a little bit.
Yeah, no, and I think another thing that helps or is another factor to consider is kind of market cycles because in 2014 when I started, things were pretty slow. It was a buyer's market and things were pretty slow overall. I probably would have done a little bit better but I think the first two years it made like 15,000 gross and I had other colleagues that started around the same time as me and they may have done a little bit better than me but not significantly.
And at the time we were definitely focused on paying off our debts, that was like number one priority. But all that to say is, you know, market cycle is another factor. Then another thing I talk about too is like if you are an agent that doesn't own a house and you're thinking that you wanna buy a house pretty quickly, jumping right into being a real estate agent will, even if you make a ton of money, unless you make enough money to buy it cash, this might not be able to work out with financing because you gotta have two years of proven income in that field.
So there's just a couple of factors that make it, or to weigh if you're kind of debating that situation.
Yeah, those are all valid things. You know, at the time my, so I moved in, so me and my wife weren't living together at the time. I move into her place, she owns her place.
Even though she owned her place, you know, I don't know if this is gonna sound bad but I'm gonna say it anyways. I was a man moving into my wife's place or my girlfriend at the time's place. I got a bad ego, I mean, and I come from a household where it wasn't like that.
So that was another battery in my back, like, you know, and it wasn't the biggest place, it was kind of a condo and I felt claustrophobic in there. So that was like, I need to get my family out of there and you know how once you get kids, that ramps it up a little bit more. So it was layers on top of I gotta win and there's no way of losing, there is no plan B, this is it, and that was my mentality.
Yeah, that was the exact same mentality I had for different reasons. And I think that is, you know, it's okay to have doubt and everything like that but like when you just know this is gonna be the route and there's just no other option and you just do everything that you know you're supposed to do, right? And you go out and get it.
So how did your first year go?
So I ended up starting at the end of 2018. I think I may have, I wanna say I started like October, September, October. I did three transactions like in the end, in December.
But then my first full year, so I guess you know how my brokerage works, your first full year is your rookie year. So my first year, I ended up doing 50 transactions. Now this is pre-kids, this is me going ballistic.
So, you know, do you mind if I get into? Yeah, go. So what the first year, what it entailed was I'm at the office 24 seven.
The reason why I'm at the office, we have this thing called phone time. So I wasn't able to get phone time because I was brand new. So I guess you gotta sell a certain amount whether it be five or 10, I can't remember what it was.
So, you know, the older agents would do phone time. But what I did is I set up shop right next to the receptions desk that would get the calls. So I'm in there, you know, great sense of humor, making people laugh, this and that.
As soon as the agents don't show up for their thing, guess who's getting those calls? I'm getting those calls. So I was like, all right, so that's one avenue.
Next avenue, I'm going to every single agent, no matter if there's a biggest agent or the smallest agent, I'm knocking on their door and like, hey, I'm willing to do open houses, I'm willing to do put signs up, I'm willing to do anything that you need, just let me know, I'm here for it. Why I can do some of those things? Because I cashed out my 401k and I got a little, you know, this is the stuff you're putting money, like the gas to go do this stuff.
I'm putting that 401k money to work to be able to impress these agents that are already in the game, so they can give me a bone. Whether I do the open houses, sometimes people didn't show up, but then sometimes people did show up. And when they did show up, that's my time to go ahead and convince them.
Another thing I did was Zillow. Everyone's like, don't do Zillow. And, you know, I see I'm in some agent groups on Facebook, Zillow is the killer of real estate, but my mentality is, if I'm not doing it, someone else is doing it, and they're wreaking the benefits off of it.
So as much as we're saying they're the bad guys, they're creating opportunities, and I just quit my job. So I'm gonna do this, and I'm gonna strategize, I'm gonna strategize it to make it work as best as possible. I don't know anything where you don't put money down for it to get profits in return.
So yeah, I could do these other things, but I also wanna have an avenue that I would never meet people before, and that was my avenue with Zillow. So I strategically picked outside of the major city. I picked a small town.
I think I started off with 150 bucks. Fast forward, you know, I ended up like at 2,000, 2,500. But I started with 150 bucks.
That opened doors for me. Last but not least, the biggest thing at the beginning of my career was, well, I'll say two things. Networking, like I said, I'm an introvert.
I hate networking with a passion. I feel a lot of times I go to these places and people are kind of doing short talk, and it's kind of like, oh, yeah, you're Gus. You work over here and know hows everything, and we're done.
I don't like it, but I needed, with the traction I was doing, I'm like doing social media posts, I needed for these people to meet me out in the public. So I forced my way to do that. Last but not least, one agent gave me a chance to go ahead and sell a mobile home that was on 20 acres of land.
The seller was completely a jerk. Now, we'll call him other words, but I'm trying to keep it PG on this podcast. But he was a jerk.
He would yell at me. He would do everything in the world. The agent's told me, Gus, you know, he's kind of difficult.
We'll take 15%. I was like, all right, cool. I got, I eventually got it sold.
You know, I did things a little bit different. So I would post it, and this is a little, some time ago, so it's a lot different now. I would post the listings on Facebook Marketplace, and I would go to barter pages and post the listings in there.
And then I found a bank that would take 20% down with what's called a portfolio loan. I found a guy who just, you know, he had an accident or something. He was getting a large lump sum of money.
We linked them together. I got that, I got that sold. What I did was they asked for 15.
I gave him 50. The reason why I gave him 50% of that, because I wanted them to tell everyone else in the office that Gus gave me 50%. Now- On a thing I didn't want to touch.
Yes, not only that, they're telling everyone that, oh, when I got someone difficult, I'm just going to give them to Gus. That was a one-time thing with the 50. Let me just say that also.
But yeah, no, that's awesome. I mean, that is like the attitude as an agent, you know, that is wanting to refer things out and wanting help is whenever you have like an eagerness, like I'll do whatever, like give it to me, yes. I'm your yes guy.
That just makes you become the go-to person. If there's like a, if there's one person that's like kind of like, oh, is this worth my time? Like, you know, am I going to do this one?
Or is it, you know, let me think through this a little bit and get back to you. Versus somebody that you send it to and they're running with it and you know they do a good job. Like you're going to give that person the business every time it comes, like whenever there's a chance, for sure.
I try to tell that to new agents and they're like, are they pre-approved? And I know I get the whole pre-approval. Don't get me wrong.
Bro, I was showing houses. I didn't care. I just had to hear what you did for a living.
Oh, yo, you're a doctor? You don't got a pre-approval? You know, I'll meet you there so me and you can create a relationship.
Then I'll go ahead and we'll try to get you pre-approved at some point. You know, I need you to get that so we can put an offer in. If you don't get it, we already built a bond.
I don't know who you know. Joe Smoll, you might meet tomorrow, might be like, oh, I'm looking for an agent. Hey, this guy Gus helped me out.
Every person was an opportunity for them to expand your name, whether they had approval or pre-approval. Now, don't get me wrong. Now, if you don't have a pre-approval, you know, I'm probably way more hesitant.
But at the beginning, I was hungry for any opportunity and try to make it work.
Yeah. Well, you know, you could really look at your initial meeting with a buyer as a good opportunity to also like meet a lender or something. Cause you know, we gotta get those brokerage agreements signed now.
And I mean, we've had to in Virginia for a while, but yeah, like you gotta get those signs. So that's a good opportunity to maybe give some education and get, give some value and not make it too long, but maybe also meet a lender, kind of get at least initial screenings done to make sure that we're all moving forward as just an idea. But yeah, no, I know I've like, but even if for me, like if I'm referring an agent, a business and they're asking me questions, like, are they pre-approved?
I'm like, I don't know. But like, you can ask that question. Like, I'm trying to give you some business.
Yes.
And I'm like, wow, are you selling 80 houses a year? Like, I thought you were just trying to get paid. I guess, I guess, you know, you need the, you need everything on the platter given to you, I guess, I don't know.
Yeah. No, but that's the, that's the attitude to cultivate right there. Like that is the attitude.
And I think I'm curious where, if you could break down some of like where your most business kind of came from, but if you get tapped into some agents that are willing to give you their leftovers, their extras, or they're like, I don't want to, or even I'm just too busy right now. And I think there's very, you know, abundantly minded people that will also give you some slam dunks. Like if they're, have a buyer coming to their listing and they wanted representation, it might've been their client before.
Like if you're the go-to person, like that's just gonna be the opportunities that you present. So sometimes you have to do the, you know, the single one on 20 acres to kind of get some of that easier stuff.
So I was doing a lot on social media, like I said, and I was doing like funny skits. I feel, and I say this to my wife, I was doing TikTok on, and our major platform is Facebook. I know this, it wasn't too long, it was like 2018, but our area of Facebook is the major platform.
Sure. Especially at that time. So I was doing like funny skits about being a real estate agent, stuff like that.
And I told myself, yo, no one's gonna take me serious until they see me do closings. As soon as I closed that mobile home, oh, I just got this done. I'm taking pictures with the guy.
He's talking, I'm recording him. He's talking about his experience with me. That's the stuff.
Now, not only those avenues I told you about how I'm getting people, now the people I've met since I've been in college and been an adult in this local area, I've met at the bank. Oh, now Gus closed on a property. Now they're contacting me.
Now they're starting to believe in me that I'm not just a guy that just decided to quit his job, be an agent. Now they're having some trust that they're seeing results all on social media platforms. So that was another thing that kicked in.
That's cool. I'd be curious, okay, so that's killing it for a first full year. That's absolutely killing it.
That's awesome. I would imagine you had similar trajectories after that. When did you start getting into investing?
So 2019, that was my first full year. 50, 2020, I was 71. 2020 was when I brought my first investment.
So now 2020, I'm making good money. My mentality is things are always too good. I'm scared it's gonna end.
So I started to work with investors. So they kind of taught me the game. And the reason why the investors started working with me is because I was quick to get to showings and just open the door.
They knew I didn't know anything. So they were like, you can't really help us as far as breaking down deals, but what you can do is just get us into these buildings. This is when the MLS, you had great opportunities on the MLS.
Things have changed a little bit since then. So I would open the doors for them. So I would help someone buy a property.
Then six months later, or maybe three to six months later, we're selling it. So I may get a check for 5,000, let's say. Then I'm reading the closing disclosure and they're getting a check for, let's say 175,000.
So if you're really a student of the game, if you're really being aware of what's going on, you're gonna ask this key question. Hey, I saw you got like 175,000. How much did you put into that?
We put in about 45,000. Okay, I helped you buy that for 65,000. So I'm doing the math.
I'm like, oh, wow. But then I go in the house, I see what he did. There was no, and then once again, this might be just for the area that you're in, but there was no granted, you know, not the stuff I saw on HGTV, not those three, 400, $500,000 houses that are normally around my area.
So I'm seeing like, okay, I'm busting my butt. $5,000, he just got one check for, you know, 135. I'm doing something wrong.
Or when I would help someone buy four units. Yeah, I'm getting the data as far as the P&L on how that works. But then I'm asking questions.
So I'm like, you know, when you're looking at this, what are some of the things that you're looking at? He's like, Gus, if you go in and you do this to the unit, and you do that, and you put this amount of money down. So they're kind of telling me this information.
Now, one big thing I was doing was bigger pockets. So they're telling me the information. And I'm listening to bigger pockets every single day since 2017, 2018.
So I'm trying to put it together. So I'm like, hey, so when, right now, you're gonna cashflow about 2,500. When you get these where they need to be, it's gonna be like 4,500?
He's like, yeah, every month? Yeah, I was like this. So I'm busting my butt.
I'm on the road. Because I was getting a lot more, obviously, when you're starting out, you're getting a lot more buyer clients than seller clients. I'm on the road 24-7, anywhere.
I'm going here, there, hour away, two hours away. I'm on the road. I'm like, so you're getting this 4,500 automatically.
So I need to get in the game. So all the money I was saving up, I'm ready to buy my first investment. My first investment I actually walked into was like a duplex in a single-family home.
I was gonna buy it. We went to the inspection. I got feedback from some people I trusted.
They're like, we don't think this is the one. All right, cool. I ended up talking to someone else.
I was helping them buy a property. He's like, yeah, I got this five-unit I'm looking to sell also in a town I'm familiar with. I was like, yeah, I can help you sell that.
Now I'm thinking like an agent. I can help you sell that? Yeah, no problem.
So we go see the place. I call one of my investor buddies. I'm like, hey, I just got a five-unit off market, you wanna come take a look at it?
I'm here with the owner right now. He goes takes a look at it. He's like, Gus, that five-unit is awesome.
Let's put it on the contract. So we ended up putting it under contract. I'm the agent.
The thing that happened was his bank didn't appraise the property for what it needed to appraise for. So in most cases, people would be like, oh, it's not a good deal. But with talking to him, only thing he could talk about how good of a deal this is.
So I sat back. Now it's a five-unit. It's real different than what I thought I was gonna get.
I thought I was gonna get a duplex, triplex, fourplex to start off with. I said to myself, you know what? Why don't I just buy this?
Let me go ahead and try. So I got introduced to commercial lending first. So I've never, except for my primary home, I've never purchased anything without it being a commercial mortgage on it.
Once I got introduced to that, I brought the five-unit in August of 2020. That was my first investment.
That's an awesome jump right in. That's amazing.
Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, that's- One of my babies to this day, probably top three or four in my portfolio.
Yeah, I'm thinking back to the interest rates then and how much appreciation it's helped us spend and how much rents have gone up.
It definitely helped. That definitely helped. How much rents have gone up.
Yes, it was a great buy. If I could go back to myself back then, I'm like, don't even think about trying to sell this, buy this right now. But yeah, it was a great buy.
Yeah, yeah, I know. I mean, how many times has that happened to people? I think that that's just kind of a mindset people get into.
And I'm gonna make a commission off this. And even if the commission would have been bigger than the first month or the first year of cashflow, let's say, I mean, just over time, that's just difference that it compounds and gets bigger and bigger. I mean, having owned real estate through the pandemic, I mean, that's, I would imagine a big chunk of your net worth at this point.
Yes, yes. So when I brought that first one in August of 2020, January comes, I buy a three unit. Then February, no, March, I buy another three unit.
So I get on the road now. So I got the bug. I was gonna manage the five unit at the beginning.
And then the day I owned it, maybe a week later, one of the toilets broke and they called me over and I'm looking like, I don't know what to do. They're looking at me like, I'm gonna save the day. I was like, I don't really know what to do.
I really don't got connections. I'm calling other investors. Yeah, who do you use for a plumber?
So I was like, I need to put this with a property management team. I kind of, I'm happy I did that. But now as a seasoned investor, I'm kind of mad I did that.
And we could get into that at some point in the conversation. Well, go ahead. I mean, do you self-manage now all the time or?
No, so everything I have right now, not everything. Majority of the stuff I have right now is with my management team. Now, the reason why I say I wish I would have managed that at the beginning, because I would have been able to understand how the money works, where it's dispersed, who am I paying?
How much are these things that were getting fixed? So this was a more like a turnkey property. This wasn't something I fixed up.
So when I'm getting my slips from the management team, I'm like cleaning. I'm like this. I'm like, I'm reading the lines.
I'm like, okay, this is not what I written down, written out at the beginning and was supposed to get. So, you know, I'm getting confused. It took me six to seven, eight months to really understand how everything worked.
That could have been six to seven months. I was doing it myself, understood it, pass it to them. And from the beginning, I could have told them how I want it.
So I feel like I missed a learning curve there at the beginning.
I see. So like you would still have it managed, but having that kind of baseline understanding of how the whole thing works, you could better manage the managers. Okay.
Yeah, that makes sense. And I think, you know, at some point, again, I think with real estate agents, we tend to try to do everything ourselves and delegation is definitely key. And also like, I mean, just for longevity of things, like if you think that this, you know, managing these properties is going to make you not buy any more or sell, like get it managed, like for sure, like get it off your plate because you can probably be spending your time in other areas that are gonna make you more money.
And owning real estate over time is, you know, the best way to become wealthy. So, yeah, man, you don't play around. You jumped in to investing and sales and just went, you know, 100 miles an hour right away.
That's awesome.
With making the money as an agent, so one thing I was noticed, cause my first few transactions, I was putting 20% down. So, you know, with bigger pockets, I'm sure everyone's a bigger pockets baby. Brandon's biggest thing is brr, brr, brr.
So I got to a point, I was like, okay, I can't keep putting 20% down. As much as that's a benefit, I need to figure other ways to be able to scale without putting that much money down. So I brought my first brr.
And with buying my first brr, I brought it for like 70,000 with the closing costs, with the fees as far as monthly fees, holding costs. And with the rehab, I was all in like 45,000. The house, so this was a single family home and it pays for 150.
So I presented it to the bank and I can get 80% back, the bank I work with, I get 80% back. So I was basically my first brr, I think I was in maybe a few thousand, but I was right there, like close to where I needed to be. And right now I still have, say it again.
A lot better than 20% down, right? 100%. And then when I got the taste of the brr, I was like, okay, so we're gonna switch our model now.
No longer are we buying 20% unless they're phenomenal deals. We're gonna look for properties where they're depleted and we can fix those up so I can retain my money. And so what I'm doing as far as a real estate agent, I can build up and I'm just using the same amount of money each particular deal.
And I think that's helped me scale 10 times since then.
Yeah, what are you doing for your holding money? Are you doing cash, equity lines, hard money? What are you doing for that?
Yep, so at the beginning I was doing cash until I got introduced to lines of credit. Wasn't really familiar. Once my banker broke it down, he was like, yeah, it's pretty much money you're able to use from the bank to do exactly what you're doing with your own money.
I was like, oh, really? So he's like, how much do you want? Because this time I already got six, seven buildings.
I was like, can I get 150,000? He's like, yeah, we can do that. I was like, dope.
So now I'm not even using my own money which I was using at the beginning. And since then my credit line is a good chunk now as way more than 150,000. So I normally buy cash, rehab with the credit line and then refi.
And I only refi and I hear this a lot. I don't really like sometimes when I hear this, if I'm all into something for 100, let's say 100,000 and the building gets appraised for 200,000 and I could get 80% of that 200,000 that would get us at 160 me and myself, I don't wanna take that extra 60,000. I just wanna take what is that I put into the building.
So I'm keeping my principal payment lower and I don't have an extra 60,000 that I'm paying on which I may not have an opportunity to place it anywhere. To me, that doesn't make any sense.
Yeah, it really depends on your goals for one. I mean, so like if you're wanting to just kind of free up your expenses through passive income, like you're trying to be 100%er where all your living is covered by passive income, that totally makes sense. I gotta say, I've mostly been in that same mindset but at the same time, I'm kicking myself for not taking out more, at least for my primary residency which is at like a 2.7% rate, I'm like, I'll never see, if I could have got another $100,000 out of this house, I will never see that kind of cheap money again. But at the same time, I do love my like $1,700 a month or whatever I'm paying in a mortgage payment on it. So yeah, I think, and there's people, a lot of people argue about like your return on equity ratios and stuff too when you kind of get into how much leverage to have. But at the end of the day, like we don't, if the market turns, like if, I know it has in some areas, you know, it's kind of, you're in a good place now, right?
Like you're in a better place. You can afford more, you can, rents could come down and you could still be okay, prices come down and you'd still be above water. So I think it's a personal thing overall but I definitely lean more that way as well.
I don't think leveraging out my eyeballs is comfortable.
Never, but then if I keep things, so I have a yearly meeting with my banker and then that's when we talk about increasing my credit line so if I'm keeping, if I'm refiling and just taking what I need, now that leaves me some money for negotiations when I ask my banker how much I want to increase my credit line for, I could just put it on that and that's something I can control when I need it. That's where I'm more of a fan of with the lines of credit.
No, that makes sense. Yeah, it makes sense. You can still tap into it.
I mean, sure, you have to pay interest on it at that point but yeah, like, I mean, you can still have access to that which, and when you get into this BRRRR kind of strategy, like it's like you're not printing money, you're like printing houses almost it feels like because you're just kind of recycling this money. So access to more is great when you can get it all back and I think it's always, you hear horror stories about people who get caught holding a few or like a number of flips or a number of whatever at the same time when markets turn and it's just, that's, I've never, we also don't have that many in our area that we can really take on, like multiple at the same time, we're a smaller market so the deals are more limited but yeah, that's always in the back of my mind as well, like just kind of trying to make sure that you're being conservative and everything, just how much you're taking, how big of a scale, et cetera.
But. If you don't mind me saying this.
Yeah.
Everyone's gonna have their different perspectives, because a lot of people say, Gus, aren't you worried about if the market turns, Gus, aren't you worried about this, that and the third? I can't control that, only thing I can control is making sure I'm buying these properties the right way, making sure their cashflow and I'm underwriting it to the best of my capabilities, making sure when we're rehabbing them, we're rehabbing them so they're lasting longer than a half-ass rehab, sorry for my language. I can do those steps.
I can't have the fear hovering over me, oh, 2008 or 2010, everything went haywire. Okay, I haven't gone through that type of situation but I'm not gonna stop and the reason why I'm not gonna stop, as a real estate agent, I work with too many people that they ended up selling because the market got crazy when COVID happened. They're making 500,000, 300,000 and I was like, all you did was hold on to the house?
All you did was have as many houses as possible and now you're just letting the single families go and you're making a crap ton of money? So my mentality right now is I don't, if you're, to me, if anyone's talking about being conservative, over-leverage and things along those lines, I can't really hear that right now. I'm laser-focused and one day this might be the downfall that this guy was an idiot because he didn't listen to what people said but I'm all in, I'm putting all my chips in and this is the time to go right now because when the next boom happens, whether it be five, 10, 30 years from now, there's no telling when that is.
That's where I'm gonna go back and be like, okay, I watched these guys make a crap ton of money. I wanna be that same person when that next boom happens and by me doing that is collecting as many properties as possible. I don't have partners.
I don't have mentors. Only thing I have is me watching how things are going and telling myself this makes sense to get as much pawns because right now I'm getting a lot of single families, get as much pawns on the board and when it's time for those pawns to sacrifice them, I'm gonna have a whole bunch of sacrificing pawns on the board.
Yeah, no, I mean, I think there's definitely wisdom to not waiting for things to be ideal. Well, I mean, because people will make that, like this is not the right time to buy or people always feel like they overpay for a house and interest rates now are one of the big things, right? It's hard to buy something that pencils out because of interest rates, especially if you're just on market, not doing any rehab but I tell people like, well, my buddy who had like 50 houses when the interest rates dropped was able to refinance them all.
He would not have been able to buy 50 houses in that window of time. And so that's definitely a key component to all this. And then on the other hand, I see people, again, this is a personal tolerance thing.
I think I see people will tap into any equity they can and then put that as a down payment on another property with a DSCR loan so that they're almost 100% leveraged even though that it pencils out of cashflow wise now, and I'm sure they're doing a lot of good calculations to make sure that everything's covered if there is a shift in the amount of rent they're getting, et cetera. So I think there's just, there's different extremes, right? And I think it's your personal preference, your personal risk tolerance and the people have been bold and have done really well, for sure.
So people have failed, so we'll see what the people have done.
I always kind of try to be a little bit moderate overall for that reason but I probably missed out on some things. Yeah, but Gus, that brings me, I mean, is that like, so you've been just investing hard ever since, right? And you've been continuing your sales.
Are you still a solo agent then as well?
No, so as an agent, I had a phenomenal, some phenomenal, I'm trying to figure out which ones are which. So in 2000, I'm looking at the plaques, 2022, 100 and then 2023, over 100 houses sold. Those are my peaks.
And after that, to be honest, you start being a little bit more selective and more giving other agents stuff. I was burnt out after 2023. On the road 24 seven, my portfolio was growing.
I'm doing births. I'm giving that a lot of time and effort to it. And I told myself, hey, this is the time where the 100% I gave as far as an agent, I'm giving that to the being an investor.
So I kind of switched. Now, a lot of people were mad at me. Maybe when I go through that office, you were a top selling agent.
And now, even though I guess mine would be respectable, I'm doing 30, 35 transactions, that's still respectable to a degree. But that's not where I was before. I was flat out posters, this and that.
But I'm like, if you saw me do this in this avenue of work, imagine what I'm gonna do over here. And this is gonna give me the biggest return. So there's active money and passive money.
Now it's time to give that passive money that full attention. And that's where I'm at right now. So I'm kind of like a part-time agent at this point.
Yeah, no, that's awesome. I mean, I think there's a couple of honest thoughts there. So following what you're passionate about is one, which that's great.
I mean, I think it's great to have the freedom to do that, right? You can choose kind of what you wanna do. And then, I mean, second of all, like I think at some point, what's the point?
Like what's the point of working 24-7, just slaving away to get every single transaction that you possibly can? And that's kind of what this show's all about is we're working towards, again, because we leave our W-2s or whatever, we leave and we try to be free by pursuing real estate and then become slaves to it, basically, right? I mean, we're working so hard that we don't have any time for ourselves.
Everything else is kind of falling. And yeah, so like working towards a different kind of freedom then. Or if you look at the cash flow quadrant, for example, like there's the employed, the self-employed, the business owners, and the investors.
And kind of when you get into the real estate ownership, I would say that you're kind of both. You're kind of a business owner and an investor. But yeah, anyway, all that to say is it's great.
I mean, I think that's a pursuit that's gonna pay dividends over time. Sometimes it doesn't always feel like you're kind of reaping it all. Like we joke around about being an investor and being cash poor, like asset-rich, cash poor.
So it kind of, it feels, you're building stuff for the future and it's awesome. We've had a long conversation. I do wanna break it into a golden nugget.
If you have one you wanna share to our audience here.
Yeah, so what I would say is a lot of this I've been saying have tunnel vision. But what I will tell everyone who's a real estate agent, and right now that's your main focus, and what you should, you should master one craft. But what you wanna do is when you become a real estate agent, when you get things going, you're gonna meet a bunch of people.
And being a real estate agent to me is your entry level into real estate. Once you get in, get in the door, you see how everything works, you're gonna come into contact with people that may take you in other directions. Be open, listen, and be aware of what other people are talking about.
Because for me, it was investing. And that took me to a whole different place I thought I would never be in. So once again, be aware of where you're at, but still have that drive and that tunnel vision also.
I love that. And we haven't even touched the tax benefits. I love this.
It's like a retirement account that you don't have to pay taxes on, or like that reduces your taxes. Especially for real estate professionals. So I love it.
That's awesome. Gus, what about a book that was fundamental for you that you think everybody should read, or maybe one that you're just currently really enjoying?
Well, what I'm gonna say is probably the book everyone says, Mr. Kiyosaki, is that his name? Robert Kiyosaki? Yeah.
Yeah, correct. What's the name of the book? Rich Dad Poor Dad?
Yes. So that was a book I read when I became an agent. Very good things that were said in there on how some people live compared...
I'm very cheap. So it was right down my alley. So I don't have the flashy car.
I feel like you can't do the things that are gonna give you wealth if you spend it on things that are gonna just make you look rich. I don't wanna look rich. I wanna be wealthy.
So that book was very instrumental as far as that. But I'm gonna be honest, since then, I have not read a book. And maybe some people could tell, and that's why- You've been focused on grinding.
No, but I really am. For me, listen to a podcast like this, listen to The Bigger Pockets, a few other podcasts. That's my avenue.
And I wanna be able to maybe give a little bit different answer so people can hear, okay, he's saying podcasts. And maybe that's more of the thing I like to listen to also. So I would definitely recommend some podcasts, talk on real estate, whatever you wanna be, listen to that.
And whatever you wanna be, read that. I guess that's the reason why.
Sure, no, I love it. And honestly, I think a lot of people in podcasts and seminars, et cetera, are kind of espouting the knowledge that are the going trending books anyway. They're kind of regurgitating that.
So that makes a lot of sense. Podcasts are great. I mean, I think the continued pursuit of knowledge is really where you're honing your craft, you're learning how you can improve yourself, everything, your world, your finances, your investing, blah, blah, blah, as you go.
That's awesome. Gus, where can people reach you or follow you? You said that you're active on Facebook still, or do you Instagram as well?
Yeah, so in the last three years, I have converted over to Instagram. It's @GusOfiliRealEstate. You can catch me over there.
I post, when I close properties, I post when they're all done and what the numbers look like. I'm a big fan of giving receipts and giving that type of information. So I would say that's the major platform to catch me on and me and my everyday and real estate, whether it be reels or stories.
Cool, awesome, Gus. Well, hey, thanks so much for being on the show. This has been a lot of fun.
I appreciate it, man. Thank you, and thank you everyone for watching.
Thanks for listening to the REI Agent.
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